25 years in 30 minutes – that was the challenge for Marcus Kirsch when Frans was a guest on The Wicked Podcast.

Highlights of the conversation included:

• The Value of design and how it fits into business (1:35)
• The benefits of design for business (3:27)
• Design leaders need to set up the right processes and tools (5:49)
• The importance of learning business language (7:37)
• The fragmentation of design (12:17)
• Innovation v Design (14:30)
• The role of design in creating competitive advantage in organisations (17:01)
• Valuable partners, design champions and allies in organisations (18:3)
• The importance of design leaders in organisations (21:51)
• What is the next phase for design? (23:51)
• Design as a driver of change, and how to take risks in the marketplace (28:05)

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